I also bet that, on whatever version of the web we’re on by that point, Alex and Dave’s children will be arguing that it’s a great workout. Oy vey.

@All

Please read the new post as I will not be responding in this thread any longer.

http://www.thedreamlounge.net/2009/08/12/strength-training-superior-to-p90x-cardio-crossfit-functional-group-exercise-fitness-classes/

Thank you

-Dream

I want to get my testimony. I just finished the P90X prgm and EVERYONE I know comments on how great of shape I’m in, espeically those who haven’t seen me a while. My 27 yr son say he’s convinced on the pgm seeing my “8 pack” as he says.

I felt I was in pretty good shape before, I surf, practice Muai Thai kick boxing, Kayak racing, tried Yoga, gyms and other workouts and this has given the best results in less time. I now catch more waves, just climbed Mt Baker with a bunch of 20-30 yr olds, I’m 57, charged the whole way. My Instuctors all comment on the changes in strenght, flexiblility & looks. I’ve dropped 25lbs and 7% BF, in 90 days.

It’s a good place to start, then add or substract what you want. Add a bench weights instead of body weight. I’ve done it with a few dumb bells and a pull up bar. Not much expense considering the equipment I see in peoples homes. There are warm ups and cool downs which is often skipped. It helped me for structure and consistency. For those who are into fitness and have a routine have at it. This is great for most people I know.

The nutition guides have helped me understand and improve my eating habits. The support I get for the community is very encouraging, and helpful. Anything I need I can find support for, great bunch of people.

I’m not fitness expert and one to support stuff that I don’t believe in. For you to say it doesn’t work and to discourage someone from trying like one of you earlier respondants, I think is a shame. For myself I’m a believer and have made many more.

Anyway just a few comments to encourage people to try it themselves. I’m reget you stance on the program.
dmowmow

I will be revising my bio soon enough due to the knee jerk reactions it has been producing- although I am not ashamed to have taken action in a specific area of my life that I did not feel was successful enough. It made sense on a fundamental level to work on “it”, and I came out all the better from it, despite the hicups and speed bumps along the way.

thanks, look forward to your thoughts on my newest post

-Anthony

I will pass on a note to the folks at USA swimming and USA cycling and have them check with you for their training program. Bob Bowman obviously doesn’t know what he is doing having Michael Phelps in the pool all day, and Lance Armstrong should spend less time on the bike. They just haven’t been told their programs don’t work.

Also, I will throw out all of my own personal data (V02Max, blood lactate, aerobic power, Wingate anaerobic capacity, etc) that I’ve generated over the years. Obviously these tests are meaningless.

I don’t have a problem with you or anyone else taking a position that p90x may not be the best program for some people (or even most people). My issue is that you have gone way beyond that and made rather sweeping claims about a lot of things that you are completely unqualified to comment on and, more important, that you have no data on. That, in my book, is the definition of arrogance. You prove this if you are willing to make the statement that athletes and the people who train them don’t know what they are doing. Meanwhile, you believe that everyone else is wrong simply because you read a book and it worked for YOU.

Sports at the highest level are a fairly brutal darwinian endeavor, and these days extremely scientific data driven. If there was a way to be successful with minimal effort and body wear and tear, I think that the secret would have come out by now. I don’t know Patrick Driver, but

In fairness to you though, I already started skimming through the book, and some valid points stick out immediately. First, I need some time to work through prior research. I will grant you, however, that Dr. McGuff’s take on genetic predisposition is something that I perhaps hadn’t given enough consideration. Call it a “self selecting sample bias”, having trained mostly with other high level athletes since I was 13 or 14 years old. Part of the genetic predisposition in this population, along with sport specific body types, is undoubtedly the ability for rapid muscular recovery.

I will say that the predisposition factor also needs to be applied to the BBS program. I’m sure it works great for some, but others will not respond to this program the same way.

As for the posts from Drew, I appreciate his experience in the field, but I also recognize that he is selling his approach to the program, and is not necessarily objective on this. Again, I do not dispute that he has personally had success and had a lot of clients that have made progress, but this is a (statistically) biased viewpoint. He believes it works because it works for him, and the clients that keep coming back are the ones who progress while those for whom the program doesn’t work move on to something else. I’m not trying to imply that there is any dishonesty. He believes in what he is selling, which is not a bad thing, but not completely objective either and it should be recognized.

Once I finish reading the book I’ll have to figure out how to incorporate this for myself as a test. It will have to be somewhere off season when I put the bike away for a month, usually at the beginning of ski season.

I think what comes out of all this discussion is the conclusion that different people with different goals have to put in some effort to find the regimen that gets them (within their genetic capabilities) to their goals.

And Anthony, as for my “pickup artist” comment in my earlier post, I can’t help that this is exactly how you present yourself in your “about me” bio. If you take offense to being labeled this way, I’m sorry, but revise your bio.

Hopefully I am ending this post a bit less testy than I began it.

Your answers lie within Body by Science, and I have also touched on them briefly before here on TDL (the rest period for example is based on the general population- they had to pick a recovery duration that fit a broad scale).

My workouts usually last anywhere from 7-20 minutes- the 12 minute is arbitrary. My recovery intervals range from 4-12 days as well.

I promise, it will make more sense as you read, and the citations are plentiful (and, in most cases, not very hard to find and read yourself).

thanks, glad to hear you’ll be back, look forward to future discussions

@ all

I am going to write a new post on P90x today with my most up to date thoughts. Too much has been repeated in the discussion here, and many people will never read this far down in the comments, which is very unfortunate (regardless of which side of the arguments you are on, people need to read this stuff!).

So, check the main blog soon enough (late today, or early tomorrow morning).

thanks for the interest and discussion- good, bad, indifferent, critical and supportive, I appreciate all of it!

-Anthony

Thanks for your earlier reply.

I’ve got a copy of the book now and have started working my way through it. I can agree, that the cardio-vascular system does not know the difference between strength training and what we refer to as “cardio”. I wear a heart monitoring while performing P90X and the super-intense plyometrics workout has me burning 850 calories in 55 minutes. Yet, I also burn almost 550 calories in the same time doing strength training, more if I up the intensity.

I also found some review of the book that challenge some of the number as arbitrary, why rest 7 days? why not 4? Why exercise for 9 minutes? Why not 6 and a half? Where do these numbers come from?

I’ve added your blog to my daily reads.

Thanks,
Tom